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Insomnia accompanying little to no beneficial e.coli
Discussion started by True 12 years ago
A stool analysis I had done a while back found no beneficial e.coli and I am wondering if it is true that this could cause insomnia like I have read. Can anyone confirm this?
Has anyone tried the e.coli supplement Mutaflor?
Also does anyone have any links to information or research regarding beneficial e.coli? Its a tough online search considering all the information about bad e.coli
thanks
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True
thanks Maff for the info and link.
I came across a very old article (British Medical Journal1913)discussing streptoccal infections of the gut..(or just an abundance of strep bacteria in the feces) and the symptoms matched my own. This particular paper noted a high cure rate using autogenous vaccines.
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2299096/pdf/…
Do you know anything about autogenous vaccines for gut infections? This was my first time reading about it and I was very amazed at the cure rate. Is this being done today by any chance?
Also wanted to ask where you found info on streptococcal infections being related to insomnia?
thanks again!
I came across a very old article (British Medical Journal1913)discussing streptoccal infections of the gut..(or just an abundance of strep bacteria in the feces) and the symptoms matched my own. This particular paper noted a high cure rate using autogenous vaccines.
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2299096/pdf/…
Do you know anything about autogenous vaccines for gut infections? This was my first time reading about it and I was very amazed at the cure rate. Is this being done today by any chance?
Also wanted to ask where you found info on streptococcal infections being related to insomnia?
thanks again!
12 years ago
Maff
Hi True,
There are two main types of Streptococcal infection (Types A and and both have the potential to cause anything from "Strep Throat" to impetigo, pneumonia, and even life-thretenting blood infections depending on factors including bacterial strain and health of the infected individual.
Stretococcus B is a normal part of the gut microflora so it wouldn't be unusual for it to show up on a CDSA/Gut Ecology Profile or similar. I believe it only needs to be treated if there is an overgrowth.
This MedlinePlus link is a great place to start learning about Stretococcal infections - www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/… that helps and good luck with the Mutaflor, definitely one of the better and most researched probiotics...and the only with commensal E. coli I believe.
There are two main types of Streptococcal infection (Types A and and both have the potential to cause anything from "Strep Throat" to impetigo, pneumonia, and even life-thretenting blood infections depending on factors including bacterial strain and health of the infected individual.
Stretococcus B is a normal part of the gut microflora so it wouldn't be unusual for it to show up on a CDSA/Gut Ecology Profile or similar. I believe it only needs to be treated if there is an overgrowth.
This MedlinePlus link is a great place to start learning about Stretococcal infections - www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/… that helps and good luck with the Mutaflor, definitely one of the better and most researched probiotics...and the only with commensal E. coli I believe.
12 years ago
True
Maff,
can you tell me what type of infections are caused by Streptococci? Or are they just caused strep infection? (trying to find more info online)
If I have been tested for other bacteria is it possible I was tested for streptococci?
I just started a trial of Mutaflor. Fingers crossed!
can you tell me what type of infections are caused by Streptococci? Or are they just caused strep infection? (trying to find more info online)
If I have been tested for other bacteria is it possible I was tested for streptococci?
I just started a trial of Mutaflor. Fingers crossed!
12 years ago
Tracy Mac
It's in a different packet but it contains the same ecoli nissle and has the same brand name so I reckon its the same thing. I really hope it works True. Keep us informed.
12 years ago
True
Thanks Tracy. Good tip about galactose.
the mutaflor I am considering is 60 capsules (though not ordering from amazon) Is this the same as what you took?
www.amazon.com/Mutaflor-Caps-Days-Supply-Brand/dp/… there more in a packet than a capsule or other added ingredients?
the mutaflor I am considering is 60 capsules (though not ordering from amazon) Is this the same as what you took?
www.amazon.com/Mutaflor-Caps-Days-Supply-Brand/dp/… there more in a packet than a capsule or other added ingredients?
12 years ago
Tracy Mac
I had been on Mutaflor for about 3 months and my PH levels were improving indicating that intestinal flora was normalising. I was also starting to feel better. But the recovery was very slow and my gut still very fragile. I had also made other modifications that could have caused the improvement.
The theory behind Mutaflor is that it should re-populate the gut within days. They give it to babies who have had dysentry and it takes off quickly in an otherwise healthy gut. You only have to look at the outbreaks of bad Ecoli that have recently swept Europe to see how quickly Ecoli(allbeit a bad strain) can take root in a receptive environment.
If your tests are showing low or no ecoli then I would think that a 3 month course of Mutaflor would be the first step. They come in packets of 100. Once you are taking them you should feed the Ecoli the kind of food it likes to eat, which are galactose rich foods.
I look forward to hearing how you go!
The theory behind Mutaflor is that it should re-populate the gut within days. They give it to babies who have had dysentry and it takes off quickly in an otherwise healthy gut. You only have to look at the outbreaks of bad Ecoli that have recently swept Europe to see how quickly Ecoli(allbeit a bad strain) can take root in a receptive environment.
If your tests are showing low or no ecoli then I would think that a 3 month course of Mutaflor would be the first step. They come in packets of 100. Once you are taking them you should feed the Ecoli the kind of food it likes to eat, which are galactose rich foods.
I look forward to hearing how you go!
12 years ago
True
hello again Tracy,
May I ask what symptoms the mutaflor was helping with before you caught the bug?
May I ask what symptoms the mutaflor was helping with before you caught the bug?
12 years ago
Maff
I've had a search of the scientific literature on Google Scholar but haven't been able to turn up much relating to low/lack of commensal E. coli and insomnia. In fact I kept coming across odd bits of research associating overgrowth of normal E. coli strains with insomnia. There also seems to be an association between high Streptococci and insomnia which I'm sure will interest Tracy.
I won't post any links because the bits and pieces I came across were not what one would call evidence of high reliability (mostly case studies).
The E. coli Nissle 1917 strain does have a very interesting history. It was isolated from the gut of a WWI soldier who survived the trenches while all his buddies were becoming sick and dying from all sorts of nasty infectious diseases.
I'd definitely think Mutaflor would be a good idea if testing showed lack of E. coli True. Good luck sourcing it and using it. Let us know if it improves your symptoms.
I won't post any links because the bits and pieces I came across were not what one would call evidence of high reliability (mostly case studies).
The E. coli Nissle 1917 strain does have a very interesting history. It was isolated from the gut of a WWI soldier who survived the trenches while all his buddies were becoming sick and dying from all sorts of nasty infectious diseases.
I'd definitely think Mutaflor would be a good idea if testing showed lack of E. coli True. Good luck sourcing it and using it. Let us know if it improves your symptoms.
12 years ago
Tracy Mac
Dr Myhill's website has instructions for growing it, if you can get the suspension which also comes from Germany and you have to speak German to access it! www.drmyhill.co.uk/wiki/…
12 years ago
True
Thank you Tracy for responding and for the tip for key word search. Do you know if it can be cultured into milk? This would help keep costs down as you know its quite expensive. I have found an online source for mutaflor coming from Canada but they dont recommend ordering in the summer. I am thinking of trying it once the weather cools down.
12 years ago
Tracy Mac
I have 'undetectable' ecoli and have not had a problem with insomnia. You can buy Mutaflor from Metropolitan Pharmacy in Germany.They speak English and you can order it by fax or email. Mutaflor can be sent by post as it can survive without refrigeration for a few days. If you are in the US customs could be a problem. I have read you can buy it in Canada. I took it for a while when my condition was a lot less worse than it is now and it was slowly starting to work, then I caught a bug and the rest is history. Nowaday it doesn't want to grow in my gutas the environment must too hostile. Re internet searches look under Ecoli Nissle for info. Very interesting history.
12 years ago
